- Discussion:
-Following are a series of excerpts from Dan Trabue with responses to them on the issue of the normalization of homosexual behavior in our culture:
"Ah, but WHO is it that is plotting even now to deny the right to marry and other basic rights to LGBTQ people?"
That is not happening anywhere except in the Middle East. No reasonable person has any plans whatsoever to deprive people of different sexual orientations of any basic human rights. They are to be treated just like everybody else.
"It's conservatives and the religious right. LGBTQ folks are NOT trying to tell straight people who they can and can't marry."
We do not generally see heterosexual people parading around the streets of cities in ridiculous and ugly attire exclaiming what they do behind closed doors. We do not see heterosexual people putting symbols of their sexuality on children's cereal boxes during a specific month of each year. Where has our culture's sense of decency and honor gone?
"Who is it who's telling transgender folks which bathrooms they must use? It's conservatives. LGBTQ folks aren't telling conservatives which bathrooms to use."
There are only two genders which are determined by genetics. That people want to be called by something other than what they really are, is no one else's problem but their own. There is no obligation on my part to affirm a man to be a woman or visa versa when all of human history up to this point did not do so.
If this matter is really all that important, then businesses should create unisex, single person restrooms. Problem solved.
"Who is it who's telling gay or lesbian couples that they can't adopt children? It's conservatives. LGBTQ people aren't trying to say that "Southern Baptists can't adopt children!"
Adoption is not a gay rights issue. It is a children's issue.
"LGBTQ people HAVE been oppressed for centuries/throughout history in nations around the world and in the US."
Even if that is true, they are not being persecuted in the West right now. This leads up to a bigger point, namely, the utter futility of trying to negotiate with people who have anger issues and entitlement problems. They are never happy no matter what you do for them, always demanding more.
"They just want to live their lives in peace and without oppression."
Dissidents just want to live their lives in peace and without fear of their children being sexualized by predators.
"Would you return to the days of criminalized homosexuality if you could?"
This question is a meaningless hypothetical.
"Would you deny the right of gay guys/lesbian women to marry who they want?"
Do people have the right to marry whoever they want without exception? Can adults marry children or relatives if they so desire? Can adults marry plants, animals, or rocks if they so choose? Is desire the only factor used in considering a potential spouse?
"It's conservatives and the religious right. LGBTQ folks are NOT trying to tell straight people who they can and can't marry."
We do not generally see heterosexual people parading around the streets of cities in ridiculous and ugly attire exclaiming what they do behind closed doors. We do not see heterosexual people putting symbols of their sexuality on children's cereal boxes during a specific month of each year. Where has our culture's sense of decency and honor gone?
"Who is it who's telling transgender folks which bathrooms they must use? It's conservatives. LGBTQ folks aren't telling conservatives which bathrooms to use."
There are only two genders which are determined by genetics. That people want to be called by something other than what they really are, is no one else's problem but their own. There is no obligation on my part to affirm a man to be a woman or visa versa when all of human history up to this point did not do so.
If this matter is really all that important, then businesses should create unisex, single person restrooms. Problem solved.
"Who is it who's telling gay or lesbian couples that they can't adopt children? It's conservatives. LGBTQ people aren't trying to say that "Southern Baptists can't adopt children!"
Adoption is not a gay rights issue. It is a children's issue.
"LGBTQ people HAVE been oppressed for centuries/throughout history in nations around the world and in the US."
Even if that is true, they are not being persecuted in the West right now. This leads up to a bigger point, namely, the utter futility of trying to negotiate with people who have anger issues and entitlement problems. They are never happy no matter what you do for them, always demanding more.
"They just want to live their lives in peace and without oppression."
Dissidents just want to live their lives in peace and without fear of their children being sexualized by predators.
"Would you return to the days of criminalized homosexuality if you could?"
This question is a meaningless hypothetical.
"Would you deny the right of gay guys/lesbian women to marry who they want?"
Do people have the right to marry whoever they want without exception? Can adults marry children or relatives if they so desire? Can adults marry plants, animals, or rocks if they so choose? Is desire the only factor used in considering a potential spouse?
"The Supreme Court conservatives may do so."
Homosexuals already had "rights" long before the Obergefell v. Hodges decision of 2015. Therefore, it is not likely that anything will change in the foreseeable future.
Appeals to public consensus as a standard of authority for what we ought to consider moral are unreliable, since culture is always subject to change. That makes it no objective or fair measure at all. "Conservative" views of marriage can make a comeback to a position of dominance as they once did over the acceptance of homosexuality by the Greco-Roman world.
"That's illegal discrimination and rightfully so. So, too, for gay customers. You don't have to like it, but discrimination based on gender, race and sexual orientation is illegal in our nation."
This is an invalid comparison. Skin color and gender are not behavioral characteristics as is homosexuality. They have nothing to do with each other. It is ironic how these people demand acceptance and toleration, while at the same time not extending the same treatment toward those who disagree with them.
"Are you saying that people who take the time to teach children are "targeting them" for propaganda?"
The content and quality of "instruction" makes the difference between night and day, but our fellow simpleton would not realize that even if it hit him in his crusty forehead. He pretends that all manner of behavior is the same, but things that are different are not the same.
"Or, when conservatives do it, they're just being helpful, but when liberals do it they're targeting and grooming children?? You see the problem with that, don't you?"
Children should be taught things like mathematics, grammar, and science, not sexualized. That is what pedophiles do. Children have no real understanding of how the world works, and should gradually be prepared to face it as their parents will not always be alive to act for them. Moreover, people have grown up to have sex for thousands of years without any teaching as to how it is done. They just procreated.
"And if you find my positions weird And tomorrow, perhaps you can understand how I also find your positions weird and immoral. As well as unbiblical, ungodly and irrational."
Why would you defend exposing children to drag queen story hour? Even their attire is a symbol of sexuality. Why cannot people be dressed in normal, modest clothing and read stories that are actually wholesome and educational?
"After all I'm not trying to be objective, I'm saying that gay folks committing to one another in a loving respectful marriage is obviously, on the face of it, a good thing. How's that bad?"
This is but wishful thinking that belittles the good and the wholesome. One can keep asking an infinite series of questions in which any grounds for reason to stand are obliterated.